Back in May, the little town of New Hope, PA had a PRIDE parade and folks from several of our local Episcopal parishes marched to incarnate our dedication to radical hospitality. That didn't make much news but we were faithful to the welcome that we often speak in church. Next year we intend to double our participation. It's about the gospel and the Reign of God. Period.

You know, as a 21 year old gay person that's very active in the church, watching this video, all I can say is that from my perspective, its just... idk... gross and disturbing, I guess would be the most accurate words to describe it. I mean, It makes it seem as though the only way I'd like something, being gay, is if a gross stereotype of myself were to tell me it likes me. In my opinion, you might as well have had the episcopal church go to a black rights parade with a black man dressed up in overalls, a straw hat, bare feet, and carrying a bucket of chicken and a slice of watermelon saying, "Thems Episcopals church shaw dooos luvs us!!" Would that make the average black person want to go? Perhaps it's a generational thing. When I came out, I had the support of my family, my friends, and my church, which is of course, this one, and I'm very thankful for that. Yet, because I was never really berated once in my life for being gay, I never got into the whole, "Gay Pride" movement. Honestly, i've never been to one, yet from what I've seen, they serve no purpose to further gay rights. If anything they hinder them. Coming from a small conservative southern town, and going to a rather conservative college, I can tell you that I've changed more hearts and minds on the subject of homosexuality and Christianity just by being myself, and not changing who I am once I came out. That in itself was a great witness it turned out, as everyones opinions of gay people here, even the ones who were questioning there own sexuality, were that gay people had to have a lisp, love gucci, and wear neon green short-shorts and hot pink tank tops with glitter. I can tell you that at the church I go to now, which is part of the episcopal church yet divided on the issue of homosexuality, that is exactly the type of picture the people who are against homosexuality think of when they think of it. They know no other than what they've been shown, and that's what they've been shown. Those are the people we need to change. I can tell you right now, from great experiance and knowing the culture quite well, there is an old conservative southern episcopalian women in her house right now. Shes probably gone to the same church for 70 something years. She's vaugely confused at all the changes in her church thats sort of just swept around her without her really understanding them, but she goes anyways. Shes heard about the some people leaving the church about the gays, and about how some bishop in new hampshire is one, but it doesn't really effect her, so its just rumors she hears at ECW meetings. Somehow, just the way life works, she will see this video. Every single opinion shes ever had of the gays, will be confirmed. All the rumors shes heard about the church, however untrue they might be, must be true. From being slightly opposed simply becuase her friends are, she is now vehemently against the gays, seeing what they are really like, and in the church, no less! Disgusted at how her church has somehow turned into the video she saw, she'll stop going to that church. (Trust me, people I know have stopped going for less.) She'll move down the street to First Baptist, or perhaps Mt. Carmel Tabernacle. Later, lets say 2-3 years down the road, her grandson tells her that hes gay, but it's ok, becuase he still the same person he was, and hes still a Christian. She'll remember the video, look at her grandson, and then think of the man in a dress and wig swinging a thurible. How do you think she'll respond?

[Editor's note: Thanks for the comment. Next time, you need to leave your full name.]

FYI. Just a little thing. This is more than just the Diocese of NY. We were a group of Episcopalians from New York, New Jersey, Long Island, as well as OASIS, and Integrity, all marching as one. Much bigger than just the diocese.

Chap James Day
Integrity NYC
Prov II Coordinator
Integrity USA

@chs210, I am entirely sympathetic to your comment and your feelings, and no, this isn't a "I feel you, BUT..." kind of response. I would just like to add that your generation and mine just a decade older need to figure out a new way forward as the old-style pride celebrations look less and less representative of self-identifying gay folks. What would this look like? And how do we guide our allies and friends into appropriate levels and expressions of solidarity? How do we draw upon our history and lore, and the history of our nation, to present a hope-filled, positive example of what can happen when a group of millenia-old outcasts believe that the blessings of liberty and justice can and must be theirs?
Pride need not be jettisoned, but molded and shaped in new ways. It is dissatisfaction with the status quo that begins the process of change and renewal, after all.

I experienced my first NYC PRIDE parade on Sunday-- and, I'm two decades older than chs210. Finally, I get to see in person this colorful expression of identity and joy!

I went through a period when I cringed every time the parade march videos came on the news because I believed it reflected on "ME" as a gay person of faith. I figured that my straight friends would believe that I was putting on a dress and make-up if I went to events like these. Finally I have come to appreciate that parades such as these celebrate the diversity of our own community. Frankly, there are gay people with lisps, and some of them go to church. And, I happen to like Gucci, and I am a postulant in seminary studying to be a priest. The diversity is what makes the LGBTQ community healthy-- and the Episcopal Church is embracing that diversity! That's a big change since I first came out.

I am from North Carolina and am a student at the very conservative Duke Divinity School. At Duke I have made several friends who have asked me to talk to them about being a gay man. They have, no doubt, seen the videos of parades past. Those events may have influenced their opinions negatively about LGBTQ people. But, they are willing to have an open dialog with me. Perhaps, for chs210, this same opportunity will occur with the 70-year-old woman in his parish. What an amazing blessing for her-- to hear about the diversity of our community from a young man.

I was so proud of the Episcopal Church this weekend. I volunteered at The Church of the Ascension to hand out water to the marchers in the parade. It was a REAL ministry as it was VERY hot. People were so grateful to us! I had many people say a very sincere "thank you" and it wasn't because of the water-- it was because I was wearing a "PROUD EPISCOPALIAN" t- shirt. They were grateful to see the radical hospitality of the Episcopal Church in action!

Following the parade there was an Evensong at St. Luke in the Fields. I was moved to tears as LGBTQ people sang hymns of worship-- at the top of their lungs! It was amazing! The thurible passed-- probably the same one from the video-- and the incense filled the room. I doubt God cared that it had been carried down Fifth Avenue a short time before; God could not have been anything but PROUD to see and hear these people singing praise and worshiping together-- in our own beautiful diversity!

Many younger GLBT folks feel that things like parades don't fit who they are and I can understand that. At the same time I would invite the younger folks to consider that this isn't just about you or the people marching in the parade but also about those who stand on the sidelines and watch. We've come a long way in just a few years and some of the people around us are still on the fence. Your way of just blending in is great, we all dreamed of that, but how will that help the people who still don't buy it? Please consider your responsibility to the people who will come after you...that's what we've been doing for quite a few years and it's because of those efforts that you enjoy what you have now.

Dear chs210 - are you reacting to the men in t-shirts and shorts as they seem to be the predominant image I see. Or are you reacting to the transgender person? Transgender persons are welcome in the Episcopal Church (even in Rock Springs WY) as well as gay men. Sorry you find that offensive and icky - maybe it will help you understand how people for generations have felt about gays and lesbians. Lucky you that you don't have to suffer as your forebears did -- rejoice.

Back in the 80's it was Integrity/NY that led a strong, out contingent of Episcopalians in the Pride March. Even then many gay Episcopalians objected to such an overt display. Better to quietly just be themselves than flaunt being gay seemed to be the argument or justification or avoidance.

To change social attitudes,the truth is it's taken a broad range of witness from simple presence to outrageous behavior. (Remember Act Up stomping on hosts at St. Patrick's Cathedral?) I would suggest we honor the courage of all who have spoken in many voices rather than assume there is only one correct behavioral road to the goal of liberty and justice for all.

I would hesitate to judge what that 70 year old Episcopal Church lady is thinking if she should chance on this rather mild video. It could be "outrageous" or " how lively." It could be "how cutting edge" or "how deviant. It might even be "I wish as a young woman I'd had the courage to live into my inner lesbian."

Dear chs210: So only the good queers are welcome in TEC, not those icky or transgendered ones?

Pride Marches are about PRIDE and about Equal Rights. They aren't about you. They are about the community, of which we are all a part. EVERYONE is welcome, not just the respectable conservative queers.

The Diocese of Los Angeles also had a contingent in the recent Christoper Street West gay pride parade in West Hollywood - the 40th anniversary edition. We were led by our new Bishop Suffragan, +Mary Glasspool, riding in a convertible.

I believe the point of our presence in the parade is one of evangelism - to let the crowd of 250,000 LGBT folks and their friends lining the sidewalks know that a place does exist where they may be able to rekindle the faith that they knew when they were younger and that we are serious when we say that "The Episcopal Church Welcomes YOU!" How often do you get an opportunity to personify that message to that kind of a crowd? We know it works because congregations tell us that they get newcomers as a result of their having seen us in the parade.

You can see pictures of both our Street Eucharist (which was celebrated in conjunction with the LGBT Lutherans) prior to the parade as well as our presence in the parade at the blog of our Diocesan Program Group on LGBT Ministry here:
http://ladioceselgbt.blogspot.com/

Jim White

The most outlandish of us force the inner dialogue: "What real harm are these people doing? Since the answer is 'none', why should I care? I should care more about the fact that they look like they're having a whole lot more fun than I am!"

Excellent female impersonators and raucus Radical Faeries are NOT NAMBLA. Their presence presents an opportunity to educate others on the difference, deepen our own levels of acceptance, and broaden our comfort zones. So the ick factor that chs experiences, and that I experience sometimes, that's not the problem of the Pride revelers. That's my problem and there's no good reason not to work to overcome it. Being together at a Pride event doesn't mean I have to live like anyone else but me, or have any other friends than those I already have, but the same goes for those we might find distasteful.

And if you want Pride to represent who you are too, then by all means, get out there with your friends, and quit staying home every year because you don't like "those people". Maybe even start a "Plain 'ol Gay" organization, throw a party and have a float like an old-fashioned Mardi Gras krewe!

As a 70 year old gay man and lawyer who has been active personally and professionally in the movement for gay freedom and equality for more years than Chs210 has been alive, I find it hard to give the unnamed "youngster" much credence, given his obvious
egocentric view of being LGBT and simple lack of knowledge of the history of our community's quest for the freedom just to be, not to mention an apparent inability to spell and use grammatical English.

If one is offended by our stereotypes, then resolve not to be one. On the other hand, some of my best friends are no less because they sometimes act stereotypically. In fact, I find them sometimes humorous, hilarious even, and cannot forget that it was the queens of Stonewall who first had the courage to fight back. We all owe them something greater than offhanded belittlement for initiating a movement from which we, young and old, now enjoy the benefits.

A better approach would be one of knowledge and mindfulness of those who came before as well as those who will follow in addition to a degree of understanding -- maybe even a sense of humor -- with respect to those of us who are a bit "different." It is, in the final analysis, what we ask of society for us all.

A story about a Stonewall veteran who wishes she could be at the parade.

There is nothing wrong with this video because it accurately reflects the variety of people who march in the Manhattan LGBT Pride Parade. It has always been a mixture of carnival and serious politicking and religious groups. My husband Murdoch and I, married in Montreal in 2005 and together for 27 years, marched with our out gay City Councilmember from Queens, Danny Dromm, along with our out lesbian Speaker Christine Quinn, the second most powerful politician in New York City, after Mayor Bloomberg, who also marched with us. We marched with the staffs of many city councilmembers, including those of out councilmembers Rosie Mendez and Jimmy Van Bramer. New York State Attorney General Andrew Cuomo, now gubernatorial candidate, US Representative Carolyn Maloney, and US Senator Kirsten Gillibrand also marched with us.

Councilmember Danny Dromm believes in including everybody in the parades. He started the Queens Pride Parade here in Jackson Heights 18 years ago and is not ashamed to be seen with drag queens. Murdoch and I marched with Danny on June 6 in Queens Pride with many different politicians, with Danny marching afterwards with a contingent of drag queens. Queens Pride has a large percentage of politicians, from Assemblymember Michael DenDekker, who has driven a car in the parade for years, and our new State Senator Jose Peralta. But, even so, we still keep the carnivalesque side because a parade is celebratory.

In Queens we also have lots of immigrants in the march, which makes our parade even more inclusive, I say, as a member of the board of Queens Pride. We have a guy called Miss Colombia who goes around in drag with a bird on his shoulder.

These parades are the one of the few times when the LGBT community can be itself in all its diversity.

Gary Paul Gilbert

In my previous post, I omitted that New York State Governor David Paterson also marched with us. Elected officials realize that a parade is a performance piece.

Gary Paul Gilbert

Agism assumes older people are less tolerant. I remember hearing that twenty years ago an older woman who was an important member of the Church of the Ascension in Manhattan asked in a meeting whether the parish could offer water to the Gay Pride marchers.

Ches Kennedy, Murdoch and I took water at Ascension this year, as we have since the late eighties. It had a nice lemon too which made it more interesting.

Chs210, You say that you the church has never berated you for being gay but you also say that your congregation is split on LGBT issues. They don't sound very supportive from what you say. It sounds like a congregation which is avoiding having a real discussion of LGBTs in the church. I have been in some like that. It is okay to be gay as long as one doesn't talk about it or celebrate one's own distinctive culture.

As for Pride events, it is very important to show elected officials there are LGBTs in their districts and that they vote. It is also equally important to let neighborhood merchants know they must treat LGBTs the same as anyone else if they want to get LGBT business. Given the ongoing discrimination against LGBTs both in the churches and in secular politics, organizing is a necessity.

Gary Paul Gilbert

I've enjoyed all these remarks. I do like the idea of reminding politicians of who butters their bread... on the other hand, I really like keeping politics out of my church. When I consider the Anglican Covenant, the problems the world has with sexuality, and the political climate of the USA, I really begin to worry that we have forgotten that we are each individuals... not one lump sum with the same ideas about life, love and God.

I'm grateful that the Episcopal Church seems to be thinking that way.

I'm also grateful that a young person like chs210 is keeping up with the Episcopal Church here at Episcopal Cafe. It is wonderful that in his divided church he is claiming his identity as a GAY person. That can be, if I remember correctly, very difficult at ANY age!

So, chs210, PLEASE, keep coming back, keep reading Episcopal Cafe. Keep commenting! Keep listening and learning and discerning-- as we all should endeavor to do!

And, if you have a chance, check out some of the pictures I posted of PRIDE on my Facebook page. There is one great photo with a guy in a "Proud Episcopalian" t-shirt. I don't think you even have to friend me to look at them!

It is a bit sad chs210 that you have no roots or idea of the sacrifices made by the very folks you now wish to throw upon the altar of embarrassed conservatism. Because those folks chose to take risks you now quietly enjoy the rights and benefits to be who you are.

I knew another young man about 21 in Seattle when I lived there to attend seminary and volunteered with a number of GLBT organizations who was not so lucky. His father found some notes that the young man had exchanged with his boyfriend. This father realized that his son was gay. He confronted the young man, told him that no son of his was going to be gay and bodily threw him through a closed second floor window into his front yard. This young man lived on the street for three days, frightened that his father would find him and finish the job he started, before we could get him to come in for treatment of the deep lacerations, the broken arm and the cracked pelvis he suffered. I am not sure how many years in prison his father received for attempted murder. Not everyone had it as good as you have.

You speak from a place of shame, heterosexism and internalized homophobia. I hope that you hang around here and we can assist you in understanding that today Pride is about a lot more than men in dresses or lime green short shorts. Not everyone you see in a dress at Pride is a man. And there is a whole panoply of folks represented in GLBTQ.

Dear CHS210,

You dear, sweet, Child of God… I am so glad that you’ve never been berated or outcast on account of your sexual identity. That’s amazing. I hope you thank God every day for that. What a remarkable blessing! I wish we could ensure that for everyone.

What baffles me is your sense of embarrassment on account of the very ones who made this possible. Could it be that you don’t know the origins of such privilege? Has no one ever told you? The privileges and freedom that you enjoy today were bought for you by those who came before you -- mainly drag queens, butch dykes, marys, and fairies, and other embarrassing Friends of Dorothy.

Yeah, there’re the ones who made your life of gay privilege possible… those icky ones, the different, embarrassing, other ones.

Let me tell you something about those icky drag queens. Maybe you haven’t thought of this before, but God made them for a reason. I am sorry that there’s a part of creation that you are willing to toss aside as icky. If you look closely you’ll see that every little thing really does have a profound beauty and purpose. Drag queens are no different. They are just another fabulous part of creation, like dogs, leaves, and even you and me.

Drag queens remind us not to be too bound to these bodies, these clothes, this particular and acceptable way of being. They let us dream of other ways we could be. Drag queens help us respect the dignity of every person by reminding us that every person really is gorgeous. Maybe they just need a little eyeliner and glitter. Drag Queens are the outward sign, the proof, that transformation is possible! And that gives me hope for my own hard, slippery, wild heart.

I don’t understand how this vibrant, shining, vital part of creation could be an embarrassment. I don’t understand how anyone -- and especially someone who has benefited as you have -- could be embarrassed on account of the very ones who bought such a gift. And so I was thinking that maybe nobody had ever told you. So, now that you know, maybe you can find it in your heart to accept those who are different with the same expansiveness with which you were accepted.

Yours sincerely,

Lindy
A loud, butch, totally unacceptable, dyke, lesbian, drag queen lover and part-time outlaw